Is Saylor Destined to Blow Up?

This is both rage bait and something I actually believe. I think Michael Saylor is behaving like a rogue trader, and I think that he will absolutely blow up, as will all of these other SPVs. When he blows up, Bitcoin is going to be down bad.

We had an eventful weekend. Basically, it started last Wednesday with a little rally up from 93 to 96. We peaked out at 98, and now we're sitting at about 95K. Equity markets are holding up okay today, looking down 30 bips, but it's not a big deal.

The real story of today is gold. Gold is up 3% today, which is kind of nuts. It seems like people are crowding back into that fear trade. We had that really sharp sell-off: We hit 3,500, came down almost 10%, and now we're off the lows, up a decent amount—5% to 6%. But it looks like fear might be slowly creeping back into the markets.

I'm curious as to your take here, Jonah. Have we hit all of our targets? The bullishness that we expressed 2 weeks ago on that podcast and then celebrated last week—are we done? Is it time to step away? If you bought extra, are you supposed to be completely out? I said dip out last week. Are you supposed to be completely out this week?

It's a great question. I think over the short term, if your time horizon is a week or 2 and you're super actively trading, yeah, I'd be concerned. I don't like that gold is up either. I think the equity markets have topped out a little bit.

To me, I think that there was peak fear priced in when the Trump tariffs first hit after Liberation Day. Then he reversed them, telegraphing a willingness to be reasonable, and markets focused. I think that now we're at the equilibrium level for that, if not a bit optimistic, because markets are pricing in a fairly benign resolution to all this, which is still very much anyone's guess.

With gold ripping, I'm concerned about equities. I'm not an active equities trader because I don't believe in going head-to-head with the sophisticated Ken Griffin-type players who I've observed in my trading career. I don't think I have an edge short-term trading equities. So, I'm basically just mentally preparing myself for another big drawdown on my stocks.

In the short run, I think it's notable that Bitcoin's up today with equities down. Equities have been up 9 days in a row, right? You can't rally forever. We have to have a pullback at some point, and Bitcoin is disconnecting again to the upside. So, I'm less concerned about Bitcoin. I do think there's a massive put under the market.

One other feature, Avi, that I want to get your take on is Bessent. In the crypto executive order—the Strategic Bitcoin Reserve that we all got so excited about back when Trump first took office—Scott Bessent's deadline to deliver a kind of manifesto or a game plan around that is due today, May 5th, right? Maybe it's not getting a lot of press, but something's going to happen there.

Bitcoin's trading more like gold and less like stocks. Looking good. Basically, in response to your question, I'm less worried about crypto than I am about equities, which could get dicey. What do you think?

Yeah, with Bitcoin, it's interesting. It's like a mix of gold, and it gets strength from both sides. I think the middle ground tends to be the worst for crypto. It's when you're facing, “Okay, well, we're not really sure if gold should be up or equities should be up.”

We had a period post-Liberation Day when we were like, “Okay, shit's collapsing. The question is, how far does it collapse?” So, you have that direction, and then you have, “Okay, we're on recovery mode. Things don't seem as bad as they are. Gold's going down, equities are going up.” You get that for 10 days.

1. Crypto Outperformers & Perpetual Shorts

I think crypto does tend to do the worst during these periods of “I have no idea,” because people tend not to want to allocate money to high-volatility assets. Although Bitcoin vol is actually pretty reasonable even now compared to equity, which has been a welcome surprise. There's been some compression there.

If I'm looking at crypto, it just goes back to what we were talking about for the previous weeks, where we're having specific outperformers in this market that are directly due to the fundamentals of these assets. You're looking at HYPE, you're looking at TAO, you're looking at Curve—all of these things that are doing really well. Monero, too. You're looking at these things that are doing really well because they're actually good assets, accumulating real users, revenues, and usage, and I think that continues.

My one thing that we haven't talked about in a while is ETH/BTC, but ETH/BTC is showing signs of life. I'm still personally giga-bearish on ETH. So, I still personally like the buy-the-HYPEs, Hyperliquids, and TAOs of the world and sell the ETH trade. But it is at least promising that we're getting some real outperformance here.

If you look at the broader market, a lot of things still aren't up, right? It's actually very specific assets that are up. There's still a lot of assets that are down substantially.

Yeah. From when equities bottomed out, TAO just does not go down. I've been wanting to accumulate more of that, and I've been waiting for a dip. My big dip buy, thanks to our conversation, was Hyperliquid back on the lows, but I didn't really buy any TAO.

I was like, “Well, it's going to keep chopping. I'm going to get some.” It's just up 3% to 8% every freaking day. It's so annoying for me. I'm really missing the boat on that one. I don't really understand what's going on there or why, other than just a general positive narrative, which I hate buying into if there's no underlying cash flow occurring.

But I know there's some cash flow. We'll talk about it. I don't know. Subnet 16 is the biggest decentralized Bitcoin miner, but is it profitable? I don't really understand. I don't know how to track it. I'm still getting smart on that ecosystem.

I don't want to go in at a size that, even if I miss the trade, I won't still feel okay about it, because I don't like piling in on things that I don't understand well enough. TAO is still kind of a mystery to me. I'm still getting smart on it.

As for broader crypto, yeah, you mentioned ETH. 3 consecutive weekly green candles is the most we've put in since 2021, so I'm watching that ETH/BTC chart very closely. I think if we get 4 green weekly candles, maybe technical voodoo suggests that it's bottomed out.

ETH is just so good at faking people out. What I will say is, it's down so much that you could get a 20% rally against Bitcoin, which would bring it up to a level that it was just at in March, at which point everyone's probably getting out.

I think there are what I call perpetual shorts in crypto. You just have to find the right entries so you're not completely squeezed out of the position. Whenever it's up 20% to 50% off the lows, you just short the shit out of it again.

ETH is one of those and has been one of those. Worldcoin is another one, where 2 weeks ago it hit $1.20, which was 60% off the lows, and you're like, “All right, time to reenter this position and try to clip another 30% to 40% when it goes lower.”

MOVE is another good one. There are a lot of these complete and utter shitcoins where you wait for a weekly candle or 2 of outperformance, or you wait for 30% to 40% off the bottom—in ETH, it's going to be a little bit less—and then you just reshort the thing and make money.

I think TIA is probably going to be the same type of trade.

Celestia? That's hilarious.

Perpetual. It's just because there are bagholders in crypto, and there are people who love to speculate. They'll just buy things because they're down, because the chart looks good.

Yeah, and what's crazy is that those guys are never going to hold.

You just have to wait for those people to get what looks like a good trade out of it, and then they're all gone. Then it's back to the VCs dumping on your head.

We can make a whole list of this. WIF is probably another one that's now in this trend.

Yeah, that wasn't in this trend before.

ICP could be a good one here. I do want to note that you don't want to do this when Bitcoin is pushing all-time highs. You don't want to do it in a euphoric market, when there are a ton of animal spirits.

You do it when you're kind of in this—this is the perfect market to do those things in, right? When you're chopping around a little bit. As long as Bitcoin's between 109 and 80, these perpetual shorts will work. Once it breaks out, maybe wait for them to reach their all-time highs and then short them again. But I do think these things are all going to zero, which makes me happy because it gives me choices of alpha.

2. Outlook for Equities?

Yeah, agreed. Inverse alt season. I mean, one of the nice things about ETH is that, unlike some of the other coins you mentioned, the FDV is just humongous. It's still a $220 billion asset. There's a lot of blood that can still leak out of this dying carcass, right? I think some of the smaller coins start to get into danger territory if the market cap drops too low and then you can get squeezed. But with ETH, even if all the short-term traders are out and the bag holders are disillusioned, there's still long-term holders who got in with a cost basis of 10 cents a token, it's trading almost $2,000 a token, and they need liquidity to fund their wedding ceremony or buy a house or a car or something. There's just this endless selling and no fresh investment. So I like the idea of the perpetual shorts.

Yeah, I 100% agree with that. I think there are a lot of people that haven't given up on ETH still. I still get messages from what I'll call crypto-adjacent people. They have 5% to 10% of their portfolio in crypto and they hold ETH still, right? They haven't, in my opinion, adjusted to the new world where ETH is losing out, and it's just been around for so long. It takes these things a long time to die. I mean, Cisco—or sorry, Staples is what I was thinking. Staples—it took a long time for Staples to go away, right? There's a lot of inertia that these types of projects can coast by on. But I do think eventually we're sort of out. The jury—sorry, what I'll say is the jury is no longer out on ETH. I think the jury's said guilty, and we're trending lower.

So when it comes to trading, I'm still in the very nimble mindset. It's like, okay, well, you have to pick your spots, but Bitcoin's looking good. I'm hopeful. I think that there will be a pullback in equities just because this sounds silly to people that don't trade, but there's a lot of psychology that comes into trading, even equities, when they're this volatile, because it's kind of all you have to go off of: psychology and emotions. The fundamentals—I mean, you can't tell me that the fundamentals of the equity markets were down 30% and then up 20%, and that was all rational pricing happening in real time. That's just clearly not what was happening.

And so when you look at the chart, this 480 to 490 area was sort of the last—that was like the little bounce that you had where a lot of people, I think, piled in hoping that, okay, this is it. We're off 20% from the highs—or sorry, 10% from the highs. Maybe we can start buying now. And I think they got trapped. So I do think that there's a lot of selling to work through here because people still aren't really sure. I mean, we're not really sure how these tariffs are going to impact the market.

What we're seeing, at least, is we're seeing hints. There's this great clip where, basically, it's really funny. They're debating the tariffs—I think it was CNBC, one of those roundtable shows—and they're going, “GM came out and said they're not going to pass on the tariff cost to the consumer. They're going to eat it all out of their profit. So they're going to go down from $15 billion net profit to $10 billion net profit. They're just going to eat it.”

GM has apparently come out and said that they're going to do this, right? They're going to eat the costs. And then suddenly the other side of the table starts going, “Well, isn't that—” It's sort of a Republican versus a Democrat, and the Democrat's starting to go, “Well, isn't what's bad for the corporation bad for the consumer, bad for the average guy?” Republicans are like, “That sounds like a Republican talking point.” Now it's like people are flip-flopping all over the place because nobody really has any idea what to even think or how to trade this. I say that point just to illustrate that.

But we are getting some indications now that companies are going to eat a substantial amount of the cost of these tariffs and they're going to try not to pass it on to the consumer, which obviously would bring valuations lower, right? Quarterly earnings are going to be revised lower. And so I do think that maybe that adjustment has happened, but I don't think it's fully happened yet. Maybe we can go down another 10% here and then we start the current rise up. I do think a lot of it also has to do with time, right? It's always about time as well. I don't know. What are you thinking?

No, I think that's a really good take. Let me just try to build on it. I think basically what the big jackknife move lower in stocks was about when the tariffs first got announced was the global investing public reevaluating a post-global-financial-crisis thesis, which has been: the government wants the number to go up, right? The government wants risk to be mitigated. The government has basically sold a gigantic put to the investor—or, sorry, the government has provided a free put to the investor, right?

And then when Trump came in and made market-unfriendly, corporate-profit-unfriendly noises, I think everybody was like, “Oh, my God, are we about to eat 3 crises' worth of medicine and go back to the lows of 2008 because we now have a president with almost unlimited power rewriting the rules and rewriting that particular number-go-up kind of game?”

And then when he flinched and listened to the calmer voices in the room, and those voices prevailed, and he did the 90-day tariff pause, I think that the markets repriced to a level that says, “Hey, actually, the government still does want the number to go up. The government still believes in a stronger stock market, believes that higher equity prices equal American exceptionalism for the most part, and they're not just going to go ahead and punish the little guy.”

The big puke down to the lows in equities was when the market thought that the government may no longer care about equity prices, when it was like, “Oh, the working man doesn't own equities, so we can take stocks wherever we want and our base will be fine.” When that got—basically, when the 90-day pause happened, that's when every investor around the world realized that the government does want the number to go up, does care about equity prices, does believe that American exceptionalism involves corporate earnings growth, right?

So now, basically, stocks are trading around an equilibrium level where tariffs are creating uncertainty, but the put is still there. The government has still provided a put to the investor base, and that gives me a lot of confidence. So basically, what I think—I do believe the put is still there, and I think it will be there until somebody gets elected into Trump's seat on a redistributionist agenda, like a Bernie Sanders-type character.

Until that happens, I think even in peak panic, you'll see politicians flinch and backstop the market. Even Trump did. So here's what I'm doing. In the scenario where what you just said plays out and volatility and uncertainty take equity markets down another 10%, Bitcoin's crashing, everything's down except gold, I'm going to be buying TAO with both hands. That's my chance.

If markets stabilize around here and just chop, I'm going to be leaning into your perpetual shorts thesis and looking for spots to short WIF, ETH, TIA—anything else that's just total vaporware. And if markets take off, happy days. I've got enough skin in the game right now that I'm going to feel okay about it. What do you think of that plan?

3. MSTR, Cantor & Bitcoin

I think that's a good plan. At least in the short term, we got the move back to this level in equities. We almost tapped $100,000 on BTC. We got a ton of good news that's come out.

I'm not really worried about a sharp move in the short term. I do think we're probably in the digestion phase. There's a lot of stuff that's come out recently about Bitcoin, including MicroStrategy's headline of raising $84 billion to go buy Bitcoin, and likely Cantor Fitzgerald really leaning into crypto.

I don't know if you saw, but there was a SPAC that just went live: the [organization name unclear], where Tether, SoftBank, and likely Cantor Fitzgerald are all ganging up to buy Bitcoin. Everybody's coming together now in this moment to basically telegraph to the world, “Hey, we're going to be investing a lot in crypto. We're probably going to be buying a ton of Bitcoin directly, and we're going to be expanding the influence of crypto throughout the world.” And we're some pretty large, influential players.

It's all in the process, and Bitcoin is not at all-time highs. That, I think, tells you a lot about the exuberance that was baked in because of the potential SBR. I think it tells you just how many billions and billions and billions of dollars were invested trying to front-run the government.

What's interesting is that these steps actually do make it more likely that an SBR happens at some point in the future. But these guys are also telegraphing buys. I do think what's going to happen is that it's going to take a little bit of time to digest.

Once the first dollars really start to hit—if likely Cantor Fitzgerald comes out and says, in their $3 billion raise, “Okay, they bought some Bitcoin,” and then they do a secondary raise—Bitcoin's at like $115,000 in my mind. I think it's just a matter of time, which is why I liked the calls when we were at $85,000, because I thought that we could get a sharp move very quickly.

Now I think it's a little bit more headline-dependent whether we go up or not. It's not necessarily a natural reversion. I thought $85,000 was way too low of a price given everything that's happened. There was going to be a sharp move that corrected this. At $95,000, it's more, “Okay, we've got all these great headlines, and that's what pushed up the price, but now we need some follow-through.”

I'm basically not touching any calls anymore. IVs are probably fairly priced, but spot BTC is a good place to hang out. I am a little bit lighter on exposure. If I was 100 out of 100 bullish at $85,000, now I'm 80 out of 100. I'm not saying let's short the market, but I'm saying it's good to have cash again because I think that we could gyrate for a bit. It'd be great to buy Bitcoin at $90,000 again, right?

Yeah. You have to predict those environments where you're going to get chop. I think that's one thing that I've been reasonably good at: post-move, trying to predict where you're going to get chop, and then stepping back a little bit so you don't get blown out of positions.

I'm trying to predict that right now: in the next week or two, there's going to be a bit of chop. So, for those of you in big positions, maybe trim it down. For those of you not in positions, don't rush in.

Yeah, I agree. My not-financial-advice advice.

None of this is financial advice, luckily. In the meantime, I agree with you that if we had just traded from $90,000 to $95,000 straight to $100,000, I think it would have been an air pocket up to $110,000 in Bitcoin. But now I think it's going to be kind of a rock fight to get to $110,000. I think it'll keep chopping.

Basically, like you mentioned, the headlines that have come out in the last week would have been a dream come true for us in 2021 or 2022. I've just compiled a few here: the SEC paused crypto enforcement and dropped the PayPal PYUSD stablecoin investigation. They also dropped a bunch of other lawsuits recently, including against my former employer, DRW.

Tether plans a US dollar-pegged stablecoin launch in 2025. The Federal Reserve lifts its bank restrictions on crypto and stablecoin activities. The likely Cantor Fitzgerald, Tether, and SoftBank $3.6 billion Bitcoin-buying venture. SoFi plans to resume crypto investing in 2025, citing favorable regulations. NVIDIA is talking about having a vote to see if they want to add Bitcoin to their balance sheet. Freaking crazy, crazy, crazy stuff.

Against that backdrop, the best performers of the last week, since we last podcasted, have been Virtuals, Hyperliquid, Monero, Maker, and TAO. I think what that tells you is we're basically entering a zone where the market is telling you which alts are going to perform on this next deregulation cycle in crypto.

It's basically RWAs, onchain DeFi, yield-bearing stuff, and AI. That's where you have to place your bets for the next leg higher. I think the market's already giving you tea leaves to read to pick your next trades.

I say 100%. I'm actually seeing it specifically on AI, which is kind of interesting. We're getting hints. One of the things that may or may not be driving this Bittensor rally, which isn't necessarily talked about a lot, is that there are some rumblings and rumors about trying to spin up MicroStrategy-like companies for other assets. Bittensor is one of those assets that people are trying to spin up these entities for.

I do think that this game is a little bit weird because it's kind of like a backdoor into an ETF. One thing that, growing up in crypto—and you in oil—you probably understand deeply is just how much money is made via regulatory arbitrage. It's kind of insane to me, and the amount of opportunity there is in regulatory arbitrage is pretty nuts.

I mean, that's kind of the entirety of crypto if you really think about it from the beginning, right? It's like you're building this alternative financial system outside of the rails. Therefore, you're subject to none of the rules. Therefore, you can build things in a new and less complex way.

Then the rules come on later, but you've already cut out all the fat. Because you didn't have to play by the rules, you were able to build a better system, and now you kind of are the system, which is great.

Yeah, but I do think that one thing this market is becoming a lot harder for your average retail investor and just for your average trader, because there are so many things that happen behind closed doors now.

I mean, if you had advanced notice of this likely Cantor Fitzgerald thing, maybe you could have put on some trades. These aren't necessarily illegal. It's a legal gray area because Bitcoin is a commodity, and if somebody's putting together a deal to go buy Bitcoin and you hear about it—maybe you get a deck—it's like, well, I don't even know if it's getting done. So, yeah, you can technically buy Bitcoin and you're not breaking any rules.

But I will say that the embrace of crypto by this administration is making it, I think, harder for your average person to trade Bitcoin. But it's making it easier for them to invest in equity markets. It's making it easier for them to invest, but the trading—right? Everything that we do, the actual trading—I mean, think about it. Why does your average guy not trade oil successfully? Because people like you at Vitol were sitting there with 300 times the amount of information as your average person on the street. How could they ever possibly compete with you?

Unfortunately, that seems to be happening in this space, which again is why I gave a shout-out on the podcast to all of the research providers. Without them, I'm completely lost in this sea of noise. Basically, you just need to be reading 24/7, networking 24/7, and talking to people 24/7; otherwise, you're just left in the dark about everything that's going on, and it's very difficult for you to make any money.

4. Will Saylor Blowup?

But that's also why hopefully you listen to this podcast, so that you know. If you listen to this podcast, one of the reasons Bittensor is doing well is because people are trying to spin up these companies. That's what we're doing. We're making it easier for people to trade, hopefully. But we're not providing investment advice along the way, obviously.

So, let's talk about—you mentioned a bunch of stuff there that I want to zoom into. I think one of the most interesting things is just the idea of Bitcoin being harder to trade but easier to invest in. I think the flows are telling us that story. If you look at the ETF flows in Bitcoin, it is absurd. May 1: $422 million. May 2: $675 million. The inflows are just incessant and unstoppable.

Meanwhile, you look at the ETH ETF. This looks like a stranded asset. April 30: $2.3 million of outflows. May 1: $6.5 million of inflows. May 2: $20 million worth of inflows. These are rookie numbers, right?

Bitcoin—I think what the flows tell you is that people are just—there's a gusher of flow into Bitcoin and very little else. As far as what you mentioned about TAO and the sort of SPV-like vehicles that are getting spun up to invest in TAO, I'm worried about those. I don't think there's any real business backing those coupon payments that need to occur for the debt that's getting raised, or even the equity. It's just vapor.

It's basically a way for people to bet other people's money, and they're going to get liquidated. They're going to get stopped out. It's going to end badly. So, I guess my biggest fear is that Saylor gets liquidated, and he always will, right? This is both rage bait, and I actually believe this. I think Michael Saylor is behaving like a rogue trader, and I think that he will absolutely blow up, as will all of these other SPVs. When he blows up, Bitcoin is going to be down bad.

I guess the big question I want to ask—I want to put this ball back in your court, Avi. If, let's say, there was no Trump put under the market and equities traded down 20%, he's blowing up this year. John Ray is going to finish up at FTX, take over the MicroStrategy bankruptcy, and liquidate Bitcoin all the way down to $10K per token, right?

But if we get another 2-year bull run and Michael Saylor keeps buying and buying and buying, and then his average price is $175K and he gets liquidated from, like, $200K, maybe the market's trading from $250K down to $150K. I think the latter scenario is more probable, but there's no rogue trade in the history of Wall Street of this size that hasn't ended in absolute tears. The only question is, does it end in tears from current prices or from some astronomical future high price—and all these other SPVs, too? What do you think?

The one way that we get out of this is that he stops buying. That is literally the one way that we get out of this: he just says, “Okay, I've accumulated almost 600,000 Bitcoin. I'm going to stop buying now, and I'm going to keep my average price at $70K, so that when Bitcoin hits $140K, it's really, really, really, really easy to refinance that debt.”

I know people really hate this because it's true, but at some point it's going to come spiraling down unless he stops buying. He can't—I mean, almost definitionally, if he keeps buying and he keeps buying at the highs, which he loves to do, he will blow up. The only way to stop him from blowing up is to not buy.

I am really, really, really looking forward to Cantor Fitzgerald and all these new MicroStrategy lookalikes figuring out—and I think I said this last time—but I really need them to figure out that you buy Bitcoin when it's down. Imagine the strength that Bitcoin would have if every time it went down 3% on a day or 2% on a day, that's when they bought.

That would be the best fucking thing on the planet if there was a literal plunge protection team on Bitcoin. Instead, there's just chase the dragon. It's insane. Basically, they're buying a ton of Bitcoin, pushing up the price. Don't get me wrong, I'm very grateful to Michael Saylor for everything that he's done for Bitcoin. But my advice to you, Saylor, if you ever watch this podcast, is: stop buying. Stop. You need to stop buying so much fucking Bitcoin.

Oh, that's good rage bait, Avi. That is good rage bait. Look, how about this? If any of our listeners know Michael Saylor or any of the people who are running any of these SPVs, send this podcast to them and tell them, “Buy when it's down. Buy low, sell high.”

And you know what? Or don't sell high—just buy low. Don't buy high. I think maybe we'd be in a better place.

The most hilarious thing about all of this, Avi, is that Michael Saylor is running the exact same playbook as Three Arrows Capital, except instead of borrowing from shitty lenders like Voyager, Celsius, Anchorage, and BlockFi, he's borrowing from more sophisticated people.

To be completely 100% fair, Jonah, Saylor's doing it with a better asset base, because Bitcoin is a great asset base. I love Bitcoin. If you're going to do this with any assets, maybe do it with equities. Do it with Bitcoin. Don't do it with AVAX, right? A 50% discount—I mean, that just doesn't make sense. Luna?

But it's the same playbook. It's the same playbook as Three Arrows. He's the Su Zhu of this cycle, except he's got more to work with than a bunch of locked Avalanche and GBTC that's trading at a massive premium. So, honestly, he scares the living daylights out of me, and this is not going to end well. That is the number-one concern that I have.

The epic trade, Avi—the epic, epic trade. Scott Bessent, in an attempt to accumulate Bitcoin for the SBR, works with the DOJ to just target—find something wrong with MicroStrategy—and send them into a bankruptcy spiral in a targeted way, the way he broke the Bank of England, and then accumulate all of that Bitcoin for the American public out of bankruptcy.

5. Ads (Ledger)

I don't know if he would do that, but imagine if he just went after all of these SPVs and MicroStrategy and just auctioned their Bitcoin. It's possible. I mean, that's unlikely. That would be pretty sick.

6. Upcoming Plans

I think we've probably enraged enough people by now. Maybe we should say something nice.

Yeah, Saylor's great. He's really helped the ecosystem. He's really, really, really—he's done a lot.

Anyway, what are you up to, Jonah? What's on the docket for today? Anything you're diving into?

Probably going to watch Frozen again. My daughter got a cold, so we decided it was okay to put her in front of some Disney for a while. She saw Frozen, and now that's all she wants to talk about and think about. So, basically, I've got the soundtrack memorized. Probably going to watch Frozen again today.

What do you have going on, Avi?

All right. Well, enjoy. I'm going to hit the gym after this and think about all the things that I've done wrong in my life to the point where I had to spend the last 10 minutes yelling about Michael Saylor.

Thank you guys for bearing with me while it happened.

At least you can go to the gym.

I would like to, but my shoulder went out. Why? Because I'm 40 and that's just what happens.

Not yet.

That's true. I'm still 39. I'll have to wait.

Anyway, it was great talking to you, Avi. I loved it as always. This was awesome. Until next week.

See you soon.