# David Hunter on the S&P 500, Bonds, Gold & Oil | What Comes Next? Jimmy Connor · 2026-09-26 · 47 min · https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abJhiKVUP10 ## Transcript Jimmy Connor David, thank you very much for joining us today. How are things in the great state of New Hampshire? David Hunter Hi, Jimmy. Good to see you. Things are pretty good. It's that time of year when we get the leaves changing, and it's probably the nicest time of year up here. Jimmy Connor I know. I love this time of year, and I love that part of the country. I've been to Mount Washington and Bretton Woods a couple of times, and maybe I'll make another trip there in the next couple of months because, as you said, it's a great time to go. So why don't we get into it? I can't believe the last time you and I spoke was in May 2025. Can you believe it was that long ago? David Hunter Wow. Yeah, we've had a few changes. Jimmy Connor Yeah, just a few. At that time, the S&P was at 5,900. Now it's at 7,700, give or take, and your target at that time was 8,000. You also said we were in the final stages of a 43-year bull run. What's your analysis now when you look at the S&P and the NASDAQ? ### The Bull Market Runs Higher David Hunter I'm still very bullish. That 43-year secular bull market turned into a 44-year secular bull market as of August of this year, and I think we've still got several months to run. Since May 2025, I've raised my targets a couple of times. My S&P target right now is 10,000, well above anybody on the Street. My NASDAQ target is 36,000, my Dow target is 70,000, and my Russell target is 4,000. You do the numbers on that, and they're all basically somewhere in the 30% to 40% area still to go on the upside. I still think AI is going to continue to go to new highs. I know a lot of people are worried about it topping. Semiconductors have been amazing, and I think they still have a good ways to go. I have a target on SMH of 800, so I think there's still a good ways to go there. You're going through a little digestion here. It's amazing. The NASDAQ made new highs 2 days ago. The market was down pretty good yesterday, and I had people on X basically panicking: “How can you be bullish here?” I said, “The market's barely off. It's off 1.5% maybe, and you guys act like it's down 10% or more.” The sentiment out there is still very nervous, I think. Jimmy Connor Well, you've made the right call, and one of the things that confounds me about this market is that the S&P and the NASDAQ just continue to climb this wall of worry. We have so much going on in the world with geopolitics. We still have war in Ukraine and the Middle East. We also have inflation, which never subsides. It just keeps going on. Then we have trade wars between the U.S. and Canada. But the markets just keep going higher. Are you surprised by this, given how many headwinds we have? David Hunter As a contrarian, my whole attitude is that the market climbs a wall of worry. As long as you've got plenty of worry out there, you're nowhere near a top. I don't try to predict the short term, so I can be surprised sometimes by a little sell-off or what have you. This one I wasn't surprised by. There's a gap down below here, so I wouldn't be surprised if there's a little more weakness in the stock market in the next couple of days. It may be another 1% down from where we were this morning. No, I think sentiment is a big key here. Until we see both institutional and retail investors all in, when you start hearing, “This has got another year, another 2, another 3 years to run. Everything's going good,” until we hear that, I'm really not concerned. That doesn't mean you can't have bigger sell-offs. I'm not seeing one right now, but it doesn't mean you can't have them along the way. I don't think we're at all near a top at this point. As you know, there's a lot of people nervous about October. A lot of people think it tops in October. That's certainly not my view. Frankly, when you've got the bond bear market that we have, with rates at the highest level since 2007, or with the fact that we haven't seen a move in rates this fast since the 1980s, those kinds of things get everybody nervous. I think bonds are bottoming and that there's a big move, a big bull market move, coming in the next 12 to 18 months in the bond market. I think there will be wind at our back. Obviously, we've got bad news out there, like Iran and things that can keep that wall of worry high and also cause issues for the market. But I'm still very bullish. Jimmy Connor The last time we spoke, you were also looking for a massive sell-off once we topped out in the markets. Do you still believe that? And if so, how much of a pullback? ### Leverage Will Trigger A Bust David Hunter I do. I get accused, rightfully so, of kicking the can down the road and continuing to stretch it out, but the cycle has gotten stretched by a number of things, Iran being the most recent one. I do think that this whole cycle ends in a global bust, and the biggest reason for that is because we have leverage through the roof—both debt and derivative leverage—at levels that have never, ever come close to these levels before. Even 2008 was nowhere close to these levels. As we know, leverage goes both ways. When you're going up, it enhances returns. It looks great. When things roll over, that leverage can really hurt you. It's leverage here in the States, but it's also leverage in Japan and throughout the world. I do think we're going to see a global bust. I keep having to stretch out the time frame. I say to people, the cycle's going to determine itself. I can guess at when that happens, but you just have to let it play out. I do think there's a decent chance—actually, a very good chance—that we see the global bust next year. But you wouldn't know it right now. Things are still pretty good in the economy. Jimmy Connor Yeah, they really are. The economy just keeps going. If I want to compare this pullback to, let's say, the tech bubble of the early 2000s, the NASDAQ bottomed after it was down 80% from its peak. Do you envision that same sort of thing happening now? David Hunter I don't call it a pullback. I call it a big bear market. Jimmy Connor Yeah. David Hunter Pullbacks are like what we had the last day or 2. I think you could see the broad market down as much as 80%. Obviously, I don't know if it'll be that or a little less, but we haven't had anything like that in the broad market since 1929. In 1929, it was down 90% between 1929 and 1932, I think. It's probably a little less than that, but if we see an 80% drop, it's going to cause a lot of pain in a lot of places. Jimmy Connor I'm curious why you pick 80%. Why not just a typical pullback or correction, like 20% to 30%? Why so severe? David Hunter The simple answer is leverage. Don't forget, I call debt the leverage on the economy and derivatives the leverage on the markets, both debt and equity markets. I think that leverage is just going to exacerbate whatever we would have had. If that leverage in the economy causes a lot of financial strain—maybe something worse than 2008–09 in terms of a financial crisis around the world, bank failures, et cetera—that is going to spill over. If you just had that and didn't have the derivatives situation, maybe the market would be down 60%. But you add in derivatives to that, and I think it can take you all the way down. Jimmy Connor This reminds me of something that happened in 2023. Remember, we had a few of these small regional banks go under, and there was a lot of speculation then that it was going to spread into something more serious. I believe 1 of them was Silicon Valley Bank, and then there was, was it First National or First Republic, and there were a couple of other ones. Yet the market—what always happens during these periods—is that the Fed or the government steps in, or JPMorgan steps in, and they remedy the whole situation. One of the things that really confounds me is that, in the last half dozen years, we continue to see speculation at a level we've never seen before, along with the leverage you've already mentioned, and yet the markets just keep going higher. It's like we go from 1 bubble to another bubble to another bubble. Remember when SPACs back in 2020–21 were the big thing? Then it was NFTs, then it was the metaverse, and it just keeps going. Then it was the Magnificent 7. Now it's AI. David Hunter Yep. Yeah, the market is rotating. Actually, I think the market has rotated and broadened, although not recently because of the correction we've had of late. That rotation has kept things from getting overheated. You had a correction in AI, a correction in semiconductors, and a correction in tech in general. We rotated. We saw, for a little while, that financials were picking up speed, and industrials have been strong all the way through. You've seen healthcare pick up speed. There’s been a rotation within the market, which allows it to self-correct along the way and not get overheated. That helps. I also think that we just had, for example, the Silicon Valley situation isolated enough. They were good-sized regional banks, but a small enough part of the banking system that they were able to work it out and have some other banks pick up part of it. It didn’t cause anything other than a short-term hiccup, and then we went merrily along. I think it’s going to be a much broader financial crisis when this thing really tips over. The banks aren’t as leveraged—certainly in this country—as they were in 2008–09, nowhere near as leveraged as then. But I think around the world, there’s enough leverage in the system. I realize a lot of the debt is sovereign debt, and I don’t think we’re going to have a sovereign crisis per se this time. But there’s enough private debt out there, and derivatives are another story unto themselves, that I do think we can get into real trouble once the rock starts rolling downhill. Jimmy Connor I think a related point is the level of speculation that we’re seeing. You have these day traders, zero-dated options, sports betting, and prediction markets. Speculation is just so pervasive throughout our economy. David Hunter Yeah, it’s certainly a sign of going back to the Robert Baron era that led up to ’29. We’re seeing legalized gambling everywhere, and that’s a sign of a top—a big top—in terms of major things going on, coming to an end and going the other way. Not to mention that real estate has been very strong for a long time. At least half the economy—those who are homeowners and those who are in the stock market—feel very well off. Their wealth seems good, but they don’t realize how fast that can change in an unwind. I think that’s what’s hard to imagine: what this will look like if you do get that kind of an unwind next year, and how fast that wealth unwind impacts people. People with that extra wealth probably have extended themselves in lots of ways that they wouldn’t have if they didn’t feel so good about their wealth. You can all of a sudden be underwater and say, “What did I do?” Jimmy Connor What indicators will you be looking for when the market is topping or near a topping level? Are you looking at credit spreads, unemployment rates, or bank lending yields? David Hunter For the market itself, the market typically will lead, so you may not see the real crux of the problem. It will begin—we’re seeing deterioration already. Obviously, there are delinquencies on debt and things that we’re seeing starting to build. We’re seeing signs that consumers—the have-not part of the economy—are having to figure out what they can give up to afford to live. I just had a family member tell me they had to buy their first order of heating oil for the winter, and they had to pay $1,000, whereas last year it was half that. It’s the heating oil situation and things like that, so we’re going to see strains out there start to build. For the market, though, it will be sentiment for me. Even going back to October of ’82 at the bottom, the institutional investor has really not been all-in on this thing. They’ve had one foot out the door throughout this bull market, thinking first that we were going back to the low 4,000s from 3,500, then that we were going to 4,800, which was the old high before we corrected in ’22. Then they raised targets along the way: 5,500, 6,000. They’re now up where many of them have raised their targets to 8,000. Like I said, I’m still a couple thousand above that, but I think they are still only cautiously optimistic. They’re going with the momentum, but nervously, saying, “Boy, any sign of trouble and I’m getting out.” You really haven’t had that all-in mentality yet, and I expect that the last run in here should be parabolic. If I’m right, I think you’ll see a very steep run, because what we’ve seen throughout this bull market is that each leg has gotten steeper. The last leg, I think, will be the steepest. It probably won’t look like Micron, but it will be that kind of vertical move where you cover 1,500 points in a couple of months. I think once that happens, as disciplined as institutional investors may think they are, they get caught up in the tape just like the retail investor. I think you will see rationale follow the tape. As the tape improves, the rationale will get more bullish, and then reach its ultimate zenith, where people are all-in and talking about this thing having— What I expect is for rates to be coming down, inflation to have rolled over, and maybe the Iran situation to have been resolved or at least gotten much better. Oil prices will be moving down, and moving down pretty sharply. I suspect those are all going to be ingredients for this last run. Jimmy Connor You mentioned oil, so why don’t we go there? This is a big part of the economy, especially for independent truckers taking goods from the East Coast to the West Coast. It’s also important for farmers. Higher diesel prices are having a huge impact on their operations. Let’s say oil is trading above $90 a barrel. It’s up and down 5% every other day, but when we started this year, I was paying $1.20 Canadian per liter. Now I’m paying $1.80, so it’s up 50%. That equates to about $4.80 for a U.S. gallon. What are you paying in New Hampshire for a gallon of regular gas? David Hunter I use the equivalent of Costco. I use BJ’s, and they have gas. I think my last fill-up was the highest I’ve paid in this whole run-up, and it was around $3.85 or something like that. I’ve spent most of my time paying around $3.40 or $3.50, and this last jump took it up there. Around the state, I think you’re looking at $4.30 or $4.35, that kind of thing. Jimmy Connor Oh, my God. David Hunter Yeah. Jimmy Connor That’s not too far off from what I’m paying in Toronto. Where do you think the price of oil is going? Are you bullish or bearish? ### Oil Prices Head Lower David Hunter I am very bearish. When we talked back in ’25, I would guess I was saying this: in the bust, you can get oil down into the 30s. It got down, obviously, to $55 before the Iran war. I think we have seen the highs in oil for quite a while, until after the bust. I believe, one way or another, you’re going to see oil back into the 70s and then the 60s, maybe this year. If not this year, then in the first quarter. From there, it will go down in the bust. I’m not one of those who thinks it can’t go a little higher here, but I believe oil is much more likely to fall from here than rise. I recognize there are a lot of people out there who believe oil is going a lot higher and are worried about the unsolvable issues in Iran. I’m not in that camp. I really do think the U.S. has Iran in a tight spot. I realize the IRGC is a whole different animal, but I’m not trying to predict that they’re going to meet and reach an agreement before the election. Any agreement you make with Iran, you can’t trust anyway, so that’s not what I’m basing it on. I think ultimately we are seeing oil get out of the Gulf, and the U.S. is pumping like crazy. Overall, it’s just not as bearish as the bears out there have driven it. As it becomes clear that we’re moving toward—before the war, there was a big surplus, and people were surprised by that. I was not. I still think that ultimately, if Iran gets resolved, you’re going to see an oil surplus become a problem, not a solution. Jimmy Connor I spoke to so many experts, or energy experts, and they all said oil was going to $150 or $200 a barrel back in March or April. Then here we are. Like— David Hunter Yeah. Jimmy Connor ... how high did it get? Like $110, maybe? I can’t remember, but it didn’t stay up there very long. David Hunter I think $120, but it was momentary. Jimmy Connor Yeah. David Hunter It was momentary. If you remember back when Russia invaded Ukraine, the talk was that it went to $130 very quickly and lasted there for a day. The talk at that time was $200—$150 and then $200. It topped out at $130, went to $120, and bounced around for a little while. I was pretty much the only bear for a long time. They fought it until it got down under $80, then they jumped on the bandwagon. You hear that from the so-called oil experts, so you look like you don’t know what you’re talking about when you’re bearish. I just think there’s more oil out there than anybody gives credit for. I think they underestimate how much demand slips when prices go up. Jimmy Connor You don’t know what sort of backroom deals are going on, too, with these oil producers. Russia, for example, is the second- or third-largest producer in the world, and I think they’re pumping out 10 million barrels a day. Even though there are sanctions on them, they’re still selling their oil to somebody. David Hunter That’s a good point. I always learned that, going back to the Arab oil embargo in the ’70s and since, oil is fungible. You can change who’s buying it, and you can change how the market’s dealing with it, but that oil has to go somewhere. It’s getting pumped out of the ground, and some of it is sitting in the Gulf, obviously, in tankers, but there’s oil moving somewhere. Maybe it’s not all aboveboard, but it’s out there. Jimmy Connor Let’s talk about bonds and yields. In January of this year, the consensus was that interest rates were going to be cut. Even in April, the president threatened Powell, saying he was going to fire him if he didn’t cut interest rates. But now here we are in September, we have a new Fed, and we just saw a 25-basis-point increase. It sounds like they’re going to increase again before the end of the year. The 10-year is firmly above 5% now. You mentioned earlier that you’re really bullish on bonds, but maybe you can take us through your thesis and where you think bonds and yields are going over the next year. ### Bonds Are Near A Bottom David Hunter I think—and again, I’m a contrarian, probably the most contrarian out there—but I believe we are making a double bottom in the bond market, or double-topping rates on the 10-year, going back to 2007. I believe we’re there. That doesn’t mean we can’t go up a few ticks more, but it’s so bearish out there. Everybody assumes inflation is going up, oil prices are going higher, and the Fed has to tighten—not only one more time, but several more times. People are trying to read the tea leaves on Warsh: “Gee, he’s more of a hawk than I realized.” I think all of that is going to be proven wrong. I think Warsh is sincere when he says inflation is our number-one job and that we have to get ahead of it. I heard a lot of criticism about this most recent hike—that he made a mistake in Jackson Hole and forced his hand by saying something there, which meant he had to act. I said, “No, he’s doing nothing wrong.” A quarter point is going to change the economy. He’s basically sending the signal, “We’ve got it. We do see that inflation has ticked up,” even though the most recent inflation numbers—CPI and PPI, before the meeting—had ticked down somewhat. He said the overall picture says we need a hike, and I don’t have any problem with that. The president probably does, but that’s because he doesn’t understand that the Fed doesn’t determine rates; the bond market does. The bond market was basically saying, “You should hike.” If he had disciplined the bond market, I think rates would have gone up faster and higher. I think he did the right thing. I think Warsh is as qualified a Fed chairman as we’ve ever had, and that includes Volcker. I like a lot about him and his approach. He gets a lot of flak from the Street because he doesn’t want to do business as usual. He wants to change communication, and I agree with him. The market shouldn’t be focused on what 12 members of the FOMC are saying about interest rates or the economy. What’s their track record? I’m not just picking on these 12—it’s pretty much the FOMC going back forever. They’re not great forecasters. Frankly, the Street is like so many economists: They’re extrapolating. They’re looking at things today and factoring in other things, but more often than not, they’re extrapolating. That means they miss turning points, and I think we’re at a turning point. I think inflation is going to trend down, and so does Warsh, by the way. I think he’s doing what he had to do in the short term, but ultimately, I think he’s pretty much in the camp that we don’t have a lot of work to do here. The picture on inflation should roll over. The complicating part is that we’re doing a lot of reshoring here in the U.S., rightfully so, and AI. We’ve got a manufacturing sector that’s pretty robust. That’s really what happened to rates yesterday: The ISM came out strong. The consumer isn’t that robust, although they’re hanging in there. The rest of the economy isn’t that robust, but the manufacturing sector is carrying the load. Ultimately, I think we’re going to find that’s not enough and that the economy is going to slow—maybe it will surprise us in one of these GDP reports when the quarter is released. All of a sudden, inflation is rolling over, GDP is rolling over, and the Fed is behind the eight ball in terms of easing. I’m not saying we’re right there yet, but I’m not worried about lots of hikes or lots of inflation ahead. I think we’re pretty close to a turning point. Jimmy Connor 2025 was a big year for both gold and silver—massive breakout years. In 2026, both have pulled back significantly, and now it looks like they’re consolidating. What are your views on gold and silver going forward? ### Gold And Silver Rebound David Hunter By the way, since we haven’t talked for almost a year and a half, I raised my target in January. I think I had a target going into January of—no, I guess I can’t remember. My January letter may have been where I raised the silver target to 125. That was before the move. It was still under 50, I think, or down in that range, and then it had that big move in a month or more, going to 122. So I’m pretty close on my target. Soon after that, I actually had a podcast during the period when it was running up. It was at 118 or something, and I said, “This thing’s up on stilts. It’s going to have a correction.” It corrected within the next few days, but I didn’t expect it to be a six-month correction. I thought it would be more like a sharp correction for a month or two, getting it back down into the high 60s, probably the mid-60s. It went further than that and corrected to 55. I raised my target in early February to 180 during that correction. I then raised it again in May, on silver, to 200, and that’s where I am now. I have a 200 target on silver. I raised my target for gold in February, I think, to 6,800, and then in June raised it again to 7,000. That’s where I am on gold. I believe this most recent pullback is very short term. I don’t think you’re going to see much more than this week. Frankly, unless things change, you have a higher low and a higher high for the week, so I think this is just backfilling. The miners gapped up last week, and I think they’re filling some gaps this week. I don’t expect silver to go much below 64, and I think the next move up is into the mid-70s and maybe higher than that. Ultimately, over the course of the next 3 to 6 months, I think you could see 200 on silver and 7,000 on gold. You may even see a steeper run than you saw in December and January. But just look at that correction: I was very bullish when silver was down in the 20s and 30s, and people were beating me up because it wasn’t moving. I was very bullish on gold back into the teens. A lot of people jumped on gold and silver in January, so they got in after the move, not before it, and then got their heads handed to them. This correction has knocked out a lot of people in terms of liking the metals complex, and they’re going to have trouble getting back in because right now they’re scared. They’re angry that they got beat up, and they’re bearish. They’re being told by lots of technicians, or certainly lots of people out there, that gold is going to 3,000 or 3,500 and silver is going to 50 or below. I think we saw our lows when silver was 55 and gold was 4,000. I don’t expect that we’re going to revisit those anytime soon. Jimmy Connor Politics plays a big part in financial markets and how they perform. The primaries are over, and we have midterms coming up here in a few short weeks. Republicans control the House and the Senate. What are your thoughts? Does that change come November? ### Politics Threatens The Bull Case David Hunter It very well could. It doesn’t look good right now for the Republicans. Obviously, the economy is a big factor here. Trump holds a lot of sway with the Republican base, and even within MAGA, even within the Republican base, there are people upset that he went into Iran. I am not one of those. I think he did the right thing, for sure. But there are people who are very upset because, after Iraq and Afghanistan, there’s very little tolerance for war right now in this country, probably lots of other places too. Even people who were very big supporters of him are angry, saying, “You told us you weren’t going into any forever wars and stuff.” But if you understand the situation, I don’t think this is a forever war. He underestimated, probably, the resilience of Iran in terms of the IRGC and what they do. Ultimately, I think he did the right thing and had to do it because of how close they were getting to having a nuclear weapon. Those who don’t want to believe that can have their own views, but there’s still a big group of support for him that believes that, although he’s lost some of that. On top of that, it’s driven up the price of oil and, obviously, the price of gasoline and heating oil. You’ve got people who are almost always voting their pocketbook in these elections who can be heard. I can remember when George H. W. Bush, the elder Bush, lost. He was only a one-term president because of the economy. It was coming back in the fall of that election year, but it didn’t come back fast enough. Clinton, with his adviser, James Carville, said, “It’s all about the economy,” and they beat that to death. That’s what we’re seeing again today. The Democrats are hitting affordability. Affordability is the catchphrase in this election, so it’s an uphill battle for the Republicans. But I’m a little hopeful because it is obviously a midterm election, so it’s more regional and more state by state. Some of the Democratic candidates are just way out there in terms of socialist Democrats—what I’d call communists if you didn’t hide behind a name. This is probably not what I think will happen, but what I hope will happen is—just like when Trump won in 2024—this midterm could be a huge election if the Democrats gain power. Number 1, Trump will become more of a lame-duck president. They’ve certainly told you they’re going to impeach him, so there’s going to be all that all over again, probably even more vehemently. The other things they’re telling us—and this isn’t just the social Democrats; a lot of Democrats are telling us this—are that they’re going to pack the court and do away with the Electoral College. The more extreme ones are saying they’ll do away with the Senate. I don’t think that’s going to happen, but you’re going to have elections that are just wide open. You’re going to open the borders, et cetera. It’s lights out for the U.S. as that shining example on the hill for everybody else in terms of a constitutional republic. If they do that, we’ve lost our constitutional republic. It won’t necessarily happen overnight, but it’ll happen over a few years. You won’t see a Republican or a conservative president again, at least in many, many decades probably, if that happens. That great American experiment could be over. I don’t exaggerate when I say the stakes are big for this election. Obviously, I don’t know what’s going to happen, but it’s a nervous time. Now, how will that impact the stock market or your 10,000 target? I think typically you don’t see tops made with elections. You don’t see tops because of politics, so it’s not changing my view. But it would have to happen pretty quickly, because those who win the election don’t get into power until January. You’ve got a couple of months until that happens, and if what I think is happening in terms of a rollover in rates, a rollover in oil prices, and some other things continues—earnings have been powerfully strong—I think most people will probably ignore that and move on with the market for a little while, because they don’t have the dire view of the outcome that I have if that happens. But it certainly could play a role for the long-term prospects for markets. Jimmy Connor Because I’m based in Toronto, I’m curious to hear your views on the Canadian economy, the Canadian political landscape, and this trade war going on between our 2 countries. David Hunter Yeah, I think it’s a shame. Obviously, we’ve been very close neighbors and feed off each other. Again, there are going to be lots of people listening to this who aren’t going to like my take, particularly the Canadians, but I don’t think it was Trump’s fault. I think people don’t realize Carney was visited by Obama and the Americans for Prosperity, or whatever that group is, a far-left group, a month before the blowup in tariffs. I think that game plan was well ahead of Trump’s and Carney’s meeting. That was planned, and if you notice, Carney did it at the last minute. The negotiators on both sides were reaching what looked like a pretty good agreement. At least both sides felt it was a step forward, and then Carney came in and blew it up. If you don’t think that’s politics for the midterms, I guarantee you Obama and his folks—and Obama, make no mistake, is still driving a lot in this country from the left—I guarantee you he said, “Do what you can to make Trump look bad here and make the Republicans look worse for the midterms.” The same thing—and this is way out there for a lot of people—but I have no doubt the left is speaking to those in Iran and saying, “Don’t…” The IRGC probably isn’t going to listen to anybody anyway. But the left in this country is not necessarily pro-American. They’re pro themselves and what I think we’re heading toward ultimately: a new world order, which I call code for a communist takeover of the world. The Russians are behind this. The Chinese are behind this. Their surrogates in Iran are behind this, as is North Korea, obviously. But make no mistake, the left around the world is in bed with those folks. I don’t understand it. I don’t know why you’d want to blow up America or blow up Western culture. We’ve been moving in this direction for decades, and I think they see we’re getting that much closer. If Trump hadn’t won in 2024, I think we would have seen that already—not necessarily a new world order, but a big step in that direction. Jimmy Connor Well, I have to disagree with you there. I think capitalism will reign supreme. The one thing I will say about Mark Carney, too, is that it’s kind of ironic because Mark Carney is prime minister because of Donald Trump. Since we have a lot of American viewers, I want to remind them that in January of 2025, Justin Trudeau and the Liberal Party were all but dead. They had one foot in the grave. They were on their way to losing official party status. Justin Trudeau resigned in January of 2025, called a leadership race, and Mark Carney won that race in March of 2025. But in those intervening months, Donald Trump was talking about Justin Trudeau as being the next governor and Canada being the 51st state, and that changed the direction of the entire Canadian election— David Hunter Oh, yeah. No question. He may be doing it again in terms of some of the stuff he’s doing here before the election. But, yeah, no question, he kind of united the Canadian voter on the other side against the conservatives. It was too bad. I did a podcast recently with some folks in the U.K., and you’re not going to agree with this either, but I was giving this same spiel about Carney. One of them piped in and said, “Yeah, Carney was probably the U.K.’s best export.” Jimmy Connor Yeah. David Hunter I just view him as a globalist. He’s working with the globalists. Just to clarify, what Trump was trying to accomplish with the trade agreement, and what he’s most upset about, is that a lot of China’s exporting stuff to you guys in steel and things like that. Then it comes in through here, and they’re getting around tariffs. They’re dumping stuff here, and Canada’s playing a role in that. Carney’s greased those skids. That’s really why. He knows the economy. Obviously, he was president of the Bank of England. He knows it, but he comes from that globalist perspective, and I have problems with that. I love the Canadians. This is not about Canada. I certainly think I have some sympathetic folks up in your country in Alberta, and I think they’d agree with me. That’s kind of where I think the conservatives are in agreement. It’s both sides of the border. The conservatives agree; it’s the globalists in both countries who are going to make this thing troublesome. Jimmy Connor Well, I think one of the great things that makes your country and my country great is the fact that we can vote these politicians in and out every 4 years. At the end of the day, I really don’t think it matters who the president or prime minister is. It all has to do with the hardworking men and women of your country and my country who get up every day, bust their asses to pay their rent, and put food on the table. That’s why our economies have done this in the last 100 years, and that’s why the stock markets have gone straight up in the last 100 years. I think that’s what really matters the most. I’ve got to say, David, I always enjoy our conversations, and I want to thank you very much for spending time with us today. If any of our viewers would like to follow you online or read some of your research, where can they go? David Hunter Yeah, so I’m on X pretty much every day. I do respond to questions and comments, and I get lots of comments, both good and derogatory. My handle is @DaveHContrarian. I’ll just caution people that, like others, I’ve got 470,000-plus followers. Like others with big followings, I’ve got people out there who take your profile and try to pretend they’re you. They just change a name or change a letter in “Contrarian” or what have you. If you look at the profile and don’t see 470,000 followers—if you see 1,000 or hundreds—you know that’s a fake account. Just be aware of that. It doesn’t happen often, but every once in a while I’ll hear from somebody who says, “I got scammed by one of those guys.” They oftentimes send you to Telegram or somewhere, and I’m not on there, so just a cautionary note there. I also write a quarterly letter. It’s by subscription, meaning it comes with a cost. If people are interested, they can direct-message me—what X now calls a chat—send me a chat message, and I will respond with details on the cost, et cetera. It’s a quarterly macro letter. On X, everything is very limited by the number of characters you can post. In a letter, I can explain my rationale and stuff better. I’ve got a pretty good subscription. Those who subscribe tell me they like it and get more out of it. Others will say, “Can I get what I need on Twitter?” I say it’s up to you. You can decide that, but they’re a little different. It’s in the eye of the beholder. Jimmy Connor I’ll include links below in the show notes. David, once again, thank you. David Hunter Thanks, Jimmy.